I am guessing many here don’t follow golf much, but this has been a huge topic of conversation in the golf world recently. The gist of the story is that the Saudi’s PIF has started a golf league called LIV (Roman numeral for 54) to rival the PGA Tour.

The PGA Tour has deep pockets, but they don’t drill money out of the ground so they obviously cannot match the money being offered by the Saudi League. The first tournament is being held outside London this week with a $25 million purse and they have already scheduled 9 other tournaments with the same purse. For perspective the largest purse ever for a golf tournament prior to this was for the PGA Tour’s Player’s Championship this year at $20 million. The Tour’s regular stop this week is the Canadian Open and it’s purse is $8.5 million. The Masters had a $16 million purse this April.

These huge purses are not all as the Saudi’s paid several players large lump sums to jump ship and commit to their tour for several years. Phil Mickelson was paid $200 million up front. Dustin Johnson and Bryson Dechambeau were both paid over $100 million up front. These events also have smaller, weaker fields so it’s easier to get high on the leaderboard and score big payouts at each event.

There are several players who have committed to the PGA Tour regardless of money like Rory McIlroy who has chided others for taking blood money and Tiger Woods who said he prefers the Tour’s setup that supports many more golfers and the development of careers of young golfers.

That’s the gist of where things stand right now. My question here as a fan and maybe if you put yourself in a player’s shoes is how would you handle this. As a fan they have put together a compelling golf TV product that I will enjoy watching. As a player getting a gigantic check that means financial security forever is nothing to slouch at. but the discomfort around the source of the money should and probably did give pause in many of these circumstances.

So what would you do as a fan? Would you watch? What about getting a huge pay bump to work for the Saudi’s? Would you take it?

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Rumor has it that Tiger was offered high nine digits to join but declined. Aren’t they also doing some weird team thing as well?


Interesting thread…?

First, some players can afford to have better morals than other players. If you are in the top 100 players, you’re probably comfortable enough that it doesn’t matter much. If you’re in the bottom 50, you may be pretty desperate for a full-time golfing job.

If you are a player, you could take the job and then reroute the fame and money to undermine the regime, as much as that’s possible.

As a fan, that’s a bit of a weird question. I’m not sure what your obligation is. I guess one thing to do would be to not spend money towards their products. Not sure how you actively disapprove of them, maybe just always turn to the guys in the bar and say, “Whoa look at that shot! It’s right next to the hole! Wow, only 911 money could pay for a shot like that!”

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One small anecdote.

The president of the Chess Federation is (of course) a former deputy prime minister of Russia, with tied to current politics.

However the Federation is against the war, and they recently dumped a top player for going off the rails on Twitter in favor of the war and Putin… And of course Kasparov (the Chess GOAT?) is a symbol of resistance

So it’s at least possible that it all turns out for the best.

Yes, the events themselves are a really cool setup. They drafted 12 4 man teams. They play a standard stroke play event and each teams 2 best scores each day go as that teams score for the day. The $25 million purse at each event is split $15 million for the individual finish of each player and $10 million for the teams finish each week.

I think in the long run these teams are expected to become franchises that could be bought and sold. much like other professional sports or F1 racing.

What are the “barriers” for joining LIV? I’ve only seen that the “big names” were enticed to join (so they don’t really need to be competitive)?

How would “competitiveness” in LIV compare to what’s available in the PGA tour? Put another way, how likely are you going to see a “diamond in the rough” excel and make a big showing through an upset at a tourney?

Where does PGA money come from? I’d need to know that before i judged a new league based on where their moneybwas coming from.

All over creation? I am a bit of the opinion that everyone on Earth has some blood on their hands. No way to get around that really. That is one of the interesting morality questions here. Does the morality change based on how directly the tie is to the immoral actor?

For instance buying a phone built from an American company built in China is less direct than taking $100 million out of a Saudi Prince’s hand who had a journalist executed for an unflattering story. Is it less moral though?

Not that much, really. Just selling your soul.

It’s team play so it’s incredibly unlikely, unless you get a team of total no-names. Which, I think the method of how teams are drawn up guarantees that it won’t happen.

If you trace anything, I’m sure there’s blood on everyone’s hands. It’s all a matter of degrees and control.

Apple has been criticized for building phones and other devices in China which helps prop up China’s government, but a notable chunk of American consumers have decided they’re OK with that. If China lured in some AP reporter who originally hailed from China and was a longtime critic of China and did to them what the Saudis did to Khashoggi, would people change their minds? I doubt it, and I doubt it would change Apple’s business strategy either. It would be thoughts and prayers for consumers followed by “yes, I would like to pay $1400 for the newest iPhone that doesn’t do anything my current iPhone doesn’t do, but … it’s purple!” and Apple would just rake in the cash and continue on like nothing ever happened.

And, since we’re in Political, two of the LIV game stops are on Trump-tied courses.

I won’t be watching, but I don’t watch that much golf anyway. I’ll watch Majors, maybe the Ryder Cup.

On my golf message board there were a lot of critics. Many of those started tempering their criticism and have gone to the “it’s their life they can do what they want stance”. I suspect that has a lot to do with the Trump locations as his tribe will not criticize him no matter what.


Well, it is. And, I do what I want in my life, which will be not to watch Bloodmoney Golf.

It is a classic moral argument in real life. Would you take X dollars from an evil person? How big would X have to be for you to accept? What must you do to accept X? (Surely it is not merely “Play Golf.”) The players are losing sponsors and they don’t seem to care, because X is more than their combined earnings from sponsors. They are doing “what’s best for their families.” Essentially, they are taking an easy PV (? or paid over time) now in lieu of future hard-to-earn earnings.


Good news from LIV: If you (a golfer) don’t want someone at a press conference, the “bosses” will remove them for you, cuz, freedum.

Shipnuck took to Twitter on Thursday to reveal that security guards had “physically” removed him from a post-round press conference featuring Mickelson on orders “from their boss.”


what’s saudi done that makes em so bad?

If your comment is serious, I know 2001 was a long time ago, but most of the attackers were either Saudi or Saudi trained. They also assassinated a journalist that they didn’t like. A couple of things off the top of my head.

Heard a funny joke on my golf forum pertaining to this. You will need to know a little about golf to get it:

Chase Koepka looks like what you would get if you ordered Brooks Koepka off of Wish

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Advertising. " Around 60% of the total comes from the Tour’s television rights deal. NBC and the Golf Channel is worth a reported $28 billion."
“The tournament sponsor is responsible for the remaining 40% of purse money.”

The sponsor gets “name placement” benefits.


america’s done worst things than that and probably killed more civilians

shouldn’t be pointing fingers

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