I think it’s more common than we know and using the term “victim” could have prejudiced the jury against Rittenhouse, so banning that use isn’t really “crazy” and I sort of understand it.
Allowing the defense to refer them as “looters and rioters” that’s the crazy part.
Crossing state lines is a nothingburger. He lived right on the border, literally 50% in one state and 50% in the other. He probably crossed that border 5-10 times a week on average.
Wading into a riot with a loaded firearm is stupid, but legal.
Yep, been to Kenosha many times. Whenever I’m in Chicago I try to visit my family in Kenosha.
Fans of the show ER may recall that when Dr. Green’s first marriage is in decline and his wife got a job in Milwaukee, his solution was to move to Kenosha so that he can keep his job in Chicago and she can work in Milwaukee. It’s basically the halfway point between those cities.
And real people certainly do commute for work from Kenosha to Chicago (although that’s pretty far) and even moreso Chicago’s northern suburbs. Like Schaumburg.
C’mon, it’s Wisconsin. We zip in, we pick 'em up, we zip right out again. We’re not going to Moscow. It’s Wisconsin.
I have read lots of things about this case and admit I was on the side of “he is a white supremacist kid I want to punch in the face who is guilty AF” when this first happened.
And I still think he’s a white supremacist punchably-faced kid who was in a stupid place with stupid and racist intentions, and he’s going to grow up to be a terrible adult as well, but I don’t know that he should be convicted for any of that.
I think the laws are flawed, as is the legal system. So technically based on how the laws were written, I don’t think he’s guilty of what most of us want him to be guilty of. He went looking for trouble and found it. He’s a bad person. But I believe bad laws are going to protect him from being held responsible.
I pride myself on being able to change my mind about things. I think my mind has been changed on this case. I don’t have high hopes of this kid becoming a decent or productive member of society, though.
How has your mind been changed on this case? It seems like you have always have, and still think “he is a white supremacist kid who behaved stupidly with racist intentions and you want to to punch in the face who is guilty AF”.
It seems like the only think that has really changed is you now longer think he will be found guilty of any crimes, but that’s only because you’ve learned more about the underlying laws. Your thoughts and feelings about; him, his thoughts, his feelings, his actions, his appearance, don’t seem to have changed.
I no longer believe he went there looking to kill anyone. I don’t believe he should be convicted for laws he didn’t break. I think the laws are bad and what he did SHOULD be against the law, but isn’t. It shouldn’t be legal for a 17 year old kid to purchase a gun and take that gun to a protest with the seeming intention of intimidation, but it seems like it is, where he was.
He is on video saying he wanted to shoot and kill people before this happened. He posed for photos with white supremacists making white supremacists signs. Why is my mind supposed to change about his character? Where is any evidence he isn’t a punk? Being a punk isn’t a crime, and neither is open carrying to a protest, although I wish it were.
I also have a hard time with the self-defense angle. If I am somewhere and see a guy with a gun saying he just killed someone and I believe he is an active shooter and try to stop him with lethal force, how is that less self-defense than a guy who brings a gun to a place he doesn’t even live with the intent of protecting it, then kills an unarmed guy after pursuing him? I understand he was scared for his life…from people who believed he was an active shooter and were trying to stop him!
This is a problem for me with good guys with guns against bad guys with guns. Anyone with a gun in that kind of situation is terrifying and I’m going to feel like my life is at risk. He was a dumb, dumb kid for setting off that chain of events.
If he wasn’t threatening you or someone else in the moment, I don’t think you have a legal right to use lethal force against him. Even if you believe that he is a criminal.
In the moment when the second guy went at him, he was not an active shooter, as I understand it.
However, if you go at him with lethal force, he does have a right to defend himself with lethal force.
Still repeating this misinformation? He lived in Kenosha half the time, has extended family there & worked there.
And more misinformation? Rittenhouse was being pursued by Rosenbaum, who had earlier threatened him, then chased him & lunged for his gun. Kyle only shot when he was attacked & Rosenbaum was in the process of lunging, no more than 4 feet away & closing.
Yeah, but I’m not sure if my amygdala is really running through that whole line of thinking when I just watched that guy kill an unarmed person, either. As I’m sure Kyle’s brain wasn’t fully logical when he was responding after setting off the first series of events, either.
I’m very against vigilante justice. I have more sympathy for someone who is in a fight or flight situation. I think Kyle intended to be a vigilante without concern for the consequences and things went about as wrong as they could have. I believe he was in a fight for his life at one point. But I also believe HE is the one responsible for all of that happening in the first place. I don’t think that’s enough to charge him with murder.
Yeah, assuming the Tangle article is accurate…
Rittenhouse was running away… not an active shooter at all.
I’m not sure this is accurate either.
I didn’t mean Kenosha. He wasn’t defending his own property. The property he was defending he had no real reason to defend. He went there looking for a fight.
As for the rest, I’ve read the accounts. The guy wasn’t armed. Kyle knew he wasn’t armed and still pointed a gun at him. That’s on record. He was afraid this guy was going to take his gun and shoot him with it. The gun he stupidly brought with the intention of antagonizing and threatening, and then didn’t enjoy the consequences of when people felt antagonized and threatened. Sympathy is hard to come by. He set off this chain of events.
Also
Also
Citation needed.
Kenosha was burning. Protests had erupted in riots. Video interviews from earlier that night show him offering aid to people.
If it were my kid, I would probably have done what I could to keep him out of that mess. Given he was there, based on the evidence I’ve seen, his gun was there for protection & to try to deter violence. Yes, that seems to have backfired. But I don’t think there’s any evidence to indicate he was looking for a fight.
Do you have a source for that? It’s pretty hard to know that someone is unarmed unless you’ve frisked them.
Rosenbaum threw something at Rittenhouse after threatening to kill him, and Huber used his skateboard as a weapon against Rittenhouse.
Also, as Kyle was fleeing from Rosenbaum, someone else (Ziminski) fired into the air, behind both of them. Kyle likely didn’t know where exactly that shot came from. This is all in the video evidence.