Oh, well if Iran is doing it…
What point are you even trying to make? “Bad actors act badly?”
Could be wrong, but I think the only thing that both sides agree on here is that this is not a war to rescue hostages.
8 Likes
Lily, the event that triggered this war was a series of pogroms against Jewish settlements in Israel. In a very real sense, the purpose of the state of Israel was to create a place where Jews could live free of pograms. That attack was, totally intentionally, an existential attack of the state of Israel. That’s what the war is about, not the hostages. The hostages are just a small piece of the story, and were taken for the purpose of blunting Israel’s response, and giving Hamas bargaining chips.
Another thing both sides agree on is that the 7 October attacks were an attempt to destroy the state of Israel.
1 Like
Ukraine feels like a stretch there. We’ve done everything short of putting American troops on the ground. Russia is a tricky rival to oppose without escalating too much and I think we’ve done about what we can there. We’ve brought Zelensky into Congress more than once and have wholeheartedly supported them.
Sudan and Ethiopia had their tragedies but absent an invasion and occupation, I’m not sure what the US would have realistically done about them. (I’ll admit, my knowledge especially on Ethiopia is weak.)
In this case, we have a developed, stable government with a defined and available leader that we can treat with.
1 Like
Yeah, I read 11 guns, which isn’t really all that many in the grand scheme of things. But I read there’s video of hostages being dragged into the hospital, so that may end up being more compelling?
2 weeks before the attack I heard a Holocaust survivor speak and he was asked what he thought the biggest difference between Jewish life in pre-war Europe and Jewish life today.
He answered that in pre-war Europe Jews had no safe haven to run to. They were always dependent on the local government being nice to the Jews in addition to being let into the country in the first place. These days, he said, we have Israel which will always be a safe haven for the Jews. IMO this is why the attacks on Oct 7 elicited such a visceral response since it attacked the very concept of why the state exists in the minds of many.
Here is the link to sign up for the weekly talks if anyone is interested.
https://www.museumoftolerance.com/education/special-speakers/hear-a-holocaust-survivor/
Seeing that came from the Museum of Tolerance, I was saddened by the irony of an all out brawl at that museum
1 Like
The counter argument there is they may have been taking hostages to the hospital for treatment.
I was expecting hamas to be using the hospital as a command center. Israel has done a really bad job showing that to be the case imo. They’ve shown a tunnel. What percentage of buildings in Gaza have a tunnel?
The problem with the Israeli response is that it is completely “reactive”.
I will say this again, as I think its important:
Hamas is not stupid. They will have been planning this for years.
They would have had plans in place in case their “headquarters” below a Hospital was in danger of being found out by IDF forces during an incursion.
Do I think that they would hide a headquarters below a hospital?
Absolutely.
Problem now is that the they are making the IDF look incompetent, which absolutely hurts Israel. This is the reason why going in slower and more methodically was the optimal way to go.
But the right-wing is now driving the military response in Israel. They are out for blood, are definitely not strategically competent, and their only real goal is to push all Palestinians out of Gaza and the West Bank. Then try to force the “Palestinian problem” to become the problem of others.
Problem is this will not work.
The US is 100% against this. Jordan will not take them in and Egypt will definitely not take them in.
So the end result of their “strategy” is the clustering of the Gaza Palestinians in the south (with nowhere to go), a rapidly deteriorating health situation (due to no infrastructure), and Israel becoming a global pariah like South Africa due to the massive levels of collateral damage (children specially).
2 Likes
The US isn’t 100% against anything. Maybe you mean the Biden administration is completely opposed to it. But this is (unfortunately) a real talking point in America.
1 Like
Yes, meant US Govt.
Why would they be dragging the hostages if that were the case?
1 Like
There were 2 videos that I saw, 1 showed a hostage being dragged/pushed into the entranceway of the hospital and the other showed a hostage being wheeled in on a stretcher.
They also found the body of Noa Marciano at the compound.
The image and video which I have seen is four or five people dragging a person into the hospital with the person resisting.
The other video was a person on the stretcher with a missing leg so it is possible that hostage was getting treatment. The first video it doesn’t look like it.
1 Like
Believe it was Iran, but not long ago was listening to an interview by a neighboring Muslim official calling Hamas and Gaza “a useful asset”.
They all know that being in Gaza is cruel, but destabilizing Israel is worth it. By propping up terror just enough to sustain it but not be overtly aggressive they win by doing nothing.
Also another picture of a kid hostage being dragged to the hospital was released this morning.
1 Like
Sounds like a deal is very close to get some hostages back.
Some groups in Israel have also considered hamas useful in the past to destabilize the Palestinian Authority. To be fair, they probably don’t think that anymore.
Because, injured or not, if you are being held hostage you try to escape.