This was on my list of “Worst things Trump could do in his last week”.
After all, Johnson pardoned confederate soldiers and Carter pardoned Vietnam war draft dodgers. It was important for “healing” and “reconciliation”.
I was pretty sure this was going to happen. The rule for Trump is “Just when you think he’s gone as low as anyone can go, he finds a lower level”.
But, then the House impeached Trump. Contemplating a Senate trial, Trump read a speech about abhorring violence. Probably, he’d see that mass pardons of his accomplices would hurt his cause. Bullet dodged.
But, then I realized that there is a middle ground. Trump could pardon all “simple trespass” violations. That would cover all the people congregating on the Capitol steps taking selfies. His followers would say that’s only just, BLM people didn’t get prosecuted for non-violent trespass on gov’t property.
So, I’ve been all over the map on this one. Any thoughts?
God I hope not. He could actually do that and I hadn’t thought of that one.
I want them prosecuted. Same as I want the rioters from this summer prosecuted. Peaceful demonstration is a good thing. Arson, looting, and property destruction are not.
And the guy who killed the Capital cop by throwing a fire extinguisher needs to be prosecuted for at least manslaughter. UP the charges if you can make them stick, but make sure he spends some serious time behind bars.
I assume he will pardon them, as a “fu” to the rest of us, if for no other reason. And i see no reason he’d go for middle ground. I think he’ll pardon all the patriots who tried to save the country from the evils of elections.
Then he’ll hop a plane for the UAE and play golf. And avoid extradition.
I was hoping for a poll so I could vote yes. And yes, there is no bottom with him. He’ll do a mass pardon in the final 24 hours (really probably once he wakes up on 1/20 and whatever he can sign), ride off into the sunset as the hero of the insurrectionists, and promise that he’ll be back in '24 to lead them to ultimate victory or some bullshit like that and sling shit at Biden every chance someone gives him.
But he read a speech saying … doesn’t matter. He didn’t want to read it, you can see it in the way he read it. He’s backtracked off it in private, is itching to put out statements somewhere on social media doubling-down on his actual thoughts.
Johnson pardoned Confederates, but the terms of surrender was that those soldiers surrender peacefully and go home and not do anything else in disloyalty to the Union. Carter pardoned Vietnam draft dodgers in a period where most people were still against us having been in Vietnam. Not a lot of controversy in either. Trump pardoning domestic terrorists would be vastly more divisive because over half the country opposes what happened - and since he’s a loser and wants to stick a sharp stick in the eye of everyone he thinks opposes him, he’ll of course do it while he can.
And yes, 90-95% of Republicans will either support it as part of healing or refuse to answer questions with the usual I didn’t hear it, I’m not familiar with what the President said chickenshit comments.
I don’t think it has any impact on conviction in the Senate. You know how Democrats are going to vote, Republicans aren’t going to change their vote based on Trump doing a mass pardon; they’ll wait to see which way Cocaine Mitch is going to go and then a large majority of them will follow him and Cocaine Mitch will do what he’s going to do regardless of what Trump does.
From the wikis%2C%20which%20provides%3A&text=shall%20have%20Power%20to%20grant,except%20in%20Cases%20of%20impeachment.) (emphasis added):
A pardon is an executive order granting clemency for a conviction. . . . In rarer cases, such as the pardon of Richard Nixon, a pardon can also halt criminal proceedings and prevent an indictment, though this has not been tested in court.
It seems to me w/o an actual conviction, Trump attempting such a pardon (regardless of how it’s worded) will likely be tested in the courts.
And since Trump is currently under an impeachment, there is that part of the Constitution that can be invoked to also nullify any such statements of pardons (and likely testing in the courts).
Nixon’s pardon was never tested because there was no political will to indict him after he resigned. So the first question is whether there would be political will to indict the rioters/insurrectionists. I think the person who killed the cop would be indicted. Though, that goes back to the idea of Trump only pardoning the large group that weren’t involved in any violence.
I don’t think that “under an impeachment” matters. Presidents who are in the middle of impeachment trials still have the full power of the Presidency.
Trump will not pardon the rioters/insurrectionists. No need to do any analysis or anything here because the reason he won’t pardon them is easy. It will never cross his mind. They aren’t him and and he is all that he thinks about.
I don’t think he’ll pardon the hoi palloi rioters.
He might pardon the ones paid (by whom? Russia? (tfh)) to do the actual planning and execution of the attempted lynching (yeah, I went there) of government officeholders. Because he’ll be forced to.
He’s a troll. So troll moves are expected. I’ve played enough video games to know how trolls think. I can switch on my troll mode as well, and if I were in his shoes, I’d do as many things to piss other off as possible. Pardoning the rioters seems like a good way to piss people off.