Israel - Hamas War October 2023

But they are pressing on with attacks.

I’m now seeing conflicting reports that says Hamas is for the cease fire? I guess this is as they say - a fluid situation.

1 Like

From 5 hours ago.

Israel has vowed to persist with its military operation in Gaza, saying it won’t engage in “meaningless” negotiations with Hamas, shortly after the United Nations Security Council overwhelmingly approved a US-backed ceasefire plan intended to bring an end to the eight-month war.

Israel’s representative to the UN, Reut Shapir Ben-Naftaly, emphasized at a UNSC meeting Monday that her country wants to “ensure that Gaza doesn’t pose a threat to Israel in the future.”

The senior diplomat said the war would not end until all hostages were returned and Hamas’ capabilities were “dismantled,” accusing the Palestinian militant group of using “endless negotiations… as a means to stall for time.”

Netanyahu has repeatedly and publicly said that his country will press on with the war in Gaza until Hamas is destroyed and the hostages are freed. But an Israeli statement on Tuesday indicated it was poised to formally sign up to the current ceasefire plan for Gaza, while at the same time maintaining the freedom to keep fighting. “Israel will not end the war before achieving all its war objectives: destroying Hamas’s military and governing capabilities, freeing all the hostages and ensuring Gaza doesn’t pose a threat to Israel in the future,” it said.

“The proposal presented enables Israel to achieve these goals and Israel will indeed do so,” the statement concluded.

So… ceasefire but we’ll continue attacking until we destroy you? Cool cool cool.

1 Like

Presumably theyll keep shooting till the ceasefire is agreed to… or Hamas gets a ceasefire without conceding anything

2 Likes

Yeah Israel agreeing to a one sided cease fire probably not in their interest. Which is why I said the situation is fluid since both sides need to agree for the cease fire to have any real meaning.

2 Likes

Israel said that the ceasefire allows them to accomplish the goals they have. They’re still attacking now because the ceasefire hasn’t gone into effect.
Hamas is giving mixed messages - some are saying they accept it, but Sinwar said no. Israeli news sources said that once again, Hamas is claiming to accept it, but they’ve changed some key provisions of the agreement, mainly around releasing hostages and the withdrawal of Israeli forces.

I think “Israel” doesn’t have noticed, rather, there’s are a lot of factions that have motives that are currently compatible.

  • Netanyahu wants to stay in power
  • A significant minority of Israelis want to take Palestinian territory and make it greater Israel
  • A large fraction of Israelis want to destroy Hamas so it can’t launch pograms against Jews within Israel.
  • Most Israelis, overlapping with the other groups, wants to get the hostages back.

All of these groups are willing to accept large numbers of Palestinian casualties to obtain their goals. But they have different customs if what happens next.

:thinking: Sounds like we can blame all the Israelis for all the Palestinian deaths, whether anyone on either side is truly innocent or not, because really no one on either side - not even the babies - is innocent at all; it’s just degrees of complicity.

1 Like

The censoring on Palestinian “views” is also a problem in the US that has become increasingly glaring.

Good piece by the Harvard and Columbia editors of their Law Review journals.

2 Likes

As someone in the US I wouldnt say that I’ve had a hard time hearing the views of pro Palestinians… what between the college protests, traditional news and GoA…

1 Like

But even if procedures are themselves content-neutral, their enforcement is often not. Because procedure is frequently an outgrowth of convention, the line between flexible adaptation and impermissible transgression is often fuzzy. And even when the rules are written down in ink, procedure is rarely followed to a T. Opponents of controversial speech can therefore almost always point to some alleged procedural deficit to rationalize censorship.

For example, Columbia banned two pro-Palestinian student groups seemingly for failing to provide 10 days’ notice about a protest. Harvard suspended the college’s only recognized pro-Palestinian student organization for publicizing an event that the group hadn’t officially co-sponsored, thereby allegedly violating the school’s co-sponsorship policy.

Eh. The will have to show signs of other, non-pro-Palestinian Groups being allowed to protest when the administrations ignore the rules.
That would be “proof” of “discrimination.”

This argument reeks of Trump-think.

Don’t forget various rallies shutting down roads, bridges, the street outside of a showing of 10/7 aftermath photos. Oh and a large part of the city of Dearborn.

Strange to be saying this. I think everyone should see an interview that Cuomo did tonight. He interviewed Mosab Hassan Yousef. This is a man with inside knowledge of Hamas. Clip may be on youtube later, interview just finished.

Here is the link to the aid attacks by extemists.

Thank you.

I wish I could get better images from that video, because Google Translate won’t pick up the text this time due to granularity. But it checks out from my non-local perspective.

That’s a plausible -and being reported by the Guardian I will say believable - video of Israeli-linked groups throwing away aid to Gazans while IDF looks on.

Israel said they would stop the terroristic blockage and destruction of humanitarian aid, just like they said they’d stop IDF from sharing videos of IDF abusing Palestinian citizens. I understand it is near-impossible to control all of your own citizenry, but it appears that the soldiers at minimum continue to aid the starvation of Palestinians.

There’s a small chance this is a hoax that was reported on by the Guardian. I eagerly await a refutation saying that the Guardian got this wrong and it’s not still happening under the watch of IDF.

Because I have my bias like anybody, but I try to pay attention to what is real. I glean from this an extremist group that I’m assuming is not explicitly encouraged by the government (as a whole, officially), but probably isn’t exactly discouraged either.

1 Like

That doesn’t seem to be the choice though. There was no indication that Hamas was ever going to free these hostages, let alone in “a few minutes”.

Israel’s choice is to go in and get the hostages or let them rot. We can debate the manner of how they go in and get them, but you’re presenting a false choice.

This is a true statement, but it’s not really fair to call a place where hostages are being held a “refugee camp” either. Hamas sucks.

“Creating a corridor” doesn’t sound like a “diversion”.