The settlers are also attacking the aid trucks.
Another issue that is being “ignored”.
The “but Hamas” explanation is simply a way of deflecting from the fact that the IDF has throttled the incoming aid, and the settlers are also attacking some of the trucks.
Very little aid gets through, so naturally people fight over the scarce resources that do make if through. This is very likely what the IDF wants ("hey look, they are fighting each other etc makes it easier to dehumanise them).
I only saw one instance of settlers attacking aid trucks, which was about a month ago. Israel stopped that from happening again, as far as I know.
The aid is now going into Gaza, but as was said, the distribution is not happening. When food does go into the populated areas, Hamas members steal it for themselves. Israel is not “throttling” the aid - if anything, Hamas is.
If you read about the rescue, you’ll see that as the Israelis were making their way out with the hostages, Hamas members began shooting at them, in middle of a busy street. Many Palestinians have accused Hamas of causing many of the deaths that occurred, because they started the shooting. Civilians were caught in the crossfire.
Yes I’d read that. How many of the dead were dead before Israel freed the hostages? As I understand it much of the death didnt happen till the commandos were attacked trying to extract. Thats meaningfully different to me than just dropping a preemptive bomb and grabbing the hostages.
Perhaps the inability to distinguish Hamas from desperate civilians is difficult to do. I remember the outcry regarding civilian deaths when the IDF did defend a convoy.
How do you distinguish Hamas raiding the food trucks from starving civilians?
Let’s think about that statement.
I fully agree,
No, unfortunately that still goes on, There is a “lunatic fringe” who also happen to be Netanyahu’s staunchest supporters
I’m not finding any credible reporting on Israelis still attacking aid trucks. I don’t disregard its possibility but I don’t feel comfortable assuming it is happening either.
I hadn’t seen recent reporting before this research that the Israeli government was officially still seizing more Palestinian land and declaring it Israeli:
I don’t know why I assumed otherwise, since they already officially took a majority of Palestinian land, mostly of the land better for agriculture, and I knew individual groups of Israelis were still expelling communities of Palestinians and taking their property and land.
I’d totally forgotten that Trump took the White House’s stance from “these settlements are illegitimate and bad for the possibility of peace” to instead be “the existing settlements are not an impediment to peace, though further expansions may not be helpful”, which Israel was happy to take as encouragement to expand further:
“What are you, darling? Where’s your costume?”
“This is my costume. I’m a homicidal maniac. They look just like everybody else.”
And yet,
That was a whole hell of a lot of “IDGAF about innocent people who got killed, they’re all at fault in some way” talk.
It gets tricky when there is “Hamas” and “people who don’t turn Hamas in”. And it’s easy to paint 200 dead as “probably mostly one of those groups.”
But when Hamas is seen as the protector against an occupying invasion - which is hard to claim you are not an invader while Palestinians watch family and friends die - then a lot of people are going to fall into the “don’t assist the invader” camp.
At least I can see logical consistency by the people who say “just carpet bomb the entire territory to the ground and build over the bodies”.
I don’t agree with implications that all those killed are innocents or even that the numbers are accurate. I don’t believe 274 died, I don’t believe the number of young are accurate and they weren’t purposefully put in harm for pure publicity reasons, I don’t believe only IDF was doing the killing or causing the weapons discharge, I believe a large number of those killed were involved in holding the hostages and I am glad the hostages are free.
I hate the innocent are being killed, but I over react to the over statements of the mass slaughter of ALL THOSE INNOCENT PEOPLE to only save four.
When people say things like that (not you, just in general) it is basically a way of deflecting blame for killing non-combatants. i.e. “you made us kill them because “reasons””.
Their “logic” is having women, very old men, very sick people, and children turning in heavily armed terrorists who will kill their extended family if they talk.
The word “fantasyland” isn’t enough to describe that mentality. Its effectively victim-blaming and and attempted deflection from killing far too many non-combatants.
The IRA did the same thing with people who talked, so its not like there is no historical precedent. Its much worse in Gaza because they are effectively trapped in a very small area. If they “talk”, they would be tracked down in no time at all.
Right, it kind of ignores the whole “if you turn us in, we will torture you and your family” aspect of “why they are not innocents”.
Let’s stop right here. You were pretty up front in your “so what if innocents got killed, we got the hostages back and that’s all that matters” language. I pressed on this, you continued to beat that drum and went even further with it. You made it patently clear that in your mind, there were no innocents, everyine who died was in some way to blame and you weren’t excusing anyone who died.
Your sudden redemption tour claiming to be sorry about innocent people being killed feels … really, really, really shallow and insincere. I’d just appreciate if you’re going to suddenly turn face, you admitted you f-ed up with your earlier statements and you were way too over the top about them.
Of course, if you want to dig in deeper on those, go right ahead.
most of my comments was are they actually innocents and my over statements were in response to the claims of mass slaughter of nothing but babies
This would be part of why I say Hamas needs to be destroyed. The Palestinians actually suffer as much or more from Hamas than the Israeli’s do. Follow that destruction up with a deradicalization program.
Interesting note on that front. The Saudis, UAE, Morocco, and Egypt are all teaching more tolerance these days. Guess who’s not making the improved list.
Rare zero nays on a US-proposed UN Security Council resolution!