This doesn’t cover stuff that’s a matter of opinion. How about joking about an average weight person that they’re fat, joking about an average looking person that they’re ugly, an average performing employee that they’re incompetent?
Hmmm, guy I work with is always pointing out to me which of our rich male clients are single. Not sure if that counts.
ETA: Actually he used to point out the rich married men too, but he seems to have stopped doing that since learning that infidelity played a significant role in my marriage ending. Now he only points out the rich and single guys.
What matters is the individual’s opinion on the matter. (The person being teased, not the teaser.)
So as an extreme example, if a person is anorexic, one shouldn’t joke about them being fat, even if they they are objectively very skinny, since they don’t see it that way.
This is why you should only joke about things that are very obviously not true with people you don’t know very well.
To Twig’s example, if i were close with a female (or gay male) coworker whom i knew was happily married, then i might joke about rich married clients. But not with an unmarried coworker.
And since it’s impossible to know all of a person’s insecurities and opinions, it’s always better to assume that all teasing is offensive when you don’t know someone extremely well.
I’m a teaser. I tease my husband and kids a lot. My husband is normally fine with it, and dishes it back. Except when he isn’t fine with it, and it offends him, and that’s on me. Intentions don’t matter, outcome does. Treat people with kindness.
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Some people seem surprised to learn that I think I am very unattractive. Please don’t joke that I am ugly. I will laugh and you’ll think it’s ok, but it isn’t.
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There is a very fine line between playful banter (“teasing”) and denigrating jokes.
And it’ll be very difficult to tell this for some. There are those who have rather thick skin and they don’t take too many things personally. While these people may be indifferent to being the butt of a denigrating joke, that doesn’t make that joke “playful banter”; it’s still denigrating.
Similarly, there are those who are very sensitive about how they’re perceived. And they’ll react pretty strongly when playful banter (intending to include them into their group) . . . often with the result of some saying that they need to “grow thicker skin”. IMO, this doesn’t make the playful banter a “denigrating joke”. (But persisting in the playful banter with such an individual when it’s known they don’t like it makes this harassment.)
In the military, we often deal with highly stressful situations–especially where we have very little control over things (like the weather)–by employing humor in some fashion. I know that this mindset often carries over to how some people deal with their own insecurities and demons. Hearing them “joke” or employ humor on a topic doesn’t grant permission for everyone else to “join in”.
Bottom line
My rule of thumb for making something of a “hard line” between the two is pretty simple:
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If it something the person generally has no control over (e.g., weight, physical deformity, etc.), it’s never playful banter.
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If it something that the person has complete control over (e.g., forgetting one’s ID badge at home), then that is fair game for a limited time (no longer than the day of the event).
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If someone expresses discomfort as a reaction to anything, then stop.
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Others doing something isn’t a precedent for something to be “ok.” Think for yourself in all situations.
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Speak up if you find something off or offensive. Either talk to the offender in private about it or to someone (HR, supervisor, trusted colleague). Nothing will change if no one knows what you’re thinking. Corollary: don’t get worked up over things you have no control over; identify where you do have control, and focus on what actions you can take
Our company has annual mandatory training where they actually use situations like this (mild laugh on the outside with a smile, completely different reaction inside) for determining what’s not appropriate in the work place.
This is a great example. Eating disorders were SO rampant at my college in particular… I watched so many young women go through this and was tempted myself a few times but thankfully never succumbed.
It’s difficult to comprehend how a person with an eating disorder views their body. It usually starts with them legitimately being 5 or 10 pounds overweight but it doesn’t stop when they get their weight down to a reasonable number. I recall talking to women who were under 90 pounds (just skin & bones at that point) and they thought they were fat. It was so heartbreaking.
Well keep in mind this is an office with a dick box where assigning clients to staff is called “doing” them… there’s a lot more inappropriate conversation than most offices I’ve worked at.
(emphasis mine)
Oh so very much this. This is something my soon-to-be-ex did not remotely comprehend. In his mind if something was funny today it’ll be funnier tomorrow and funnier still in a week, a month, a year. And laughing at something once was license to bring it up incessantly for all eternity.
“But you laughed when I said that!”
Yeah, it was funny once. Now you’re just putting me down. Constantly.
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Context is everything.
Back to Twig’s example, I don’t see how joking about a rich single client would usually be funny.
Here is how it could be funny: suppose Twig is working with a client she really doesn’t like, and is telling you about how she plans to get off the project. Then it might be funny to joke something like: Well, you could do that, but you know i’m also pretty sure he’s single, and i bet he has a lot of money. So you could double down, and probably get a big house and a nice car out of it.
Then maybe i’d add: shoot, maybe i should pursue him!
Then the tease is really about how we all are sometimes tempted to make ourselves miserable for money.
Simply teasing somebody about their characteristics is not usually going to be funny. But the problem is not the teasing per se, it’s that it isn’t funny, or even is mean if it is something true about themselves they don’t like.
It’s sort of in that vein. I mean, this guy does it with all of the single people in the office. We have access to income data and if we have a question about an opposite sex* wealthy client the guy will point out “look at that income twig… and he’s single!!!”
And especially if the client is coming into the office, it’s always pointed out.
*AFAIK we are all straight. Pretty small office, but disproportionately single folk.
Your office sounds like it is just waiting for a sexual harassment lawsuit.
I mean we’re all a little sassy. I don’t see anyone raising a fuss… but when we have a new person I do cringe.
Do microaggressions count?
Only if you’re a cracker.