I agree with you about flying. Except that a always get a thrill watching the land pull away from the plane, and looking at mountains and farmland and cities from above. I love looking out the window on airplanes.
And i love being in a foreign city, seeing new things, trying new foods, meeting new people…
Yeah, i miss travel.
I am SO glad i said, “screw company policy, I’m going to the cas meeting in Hawaii even if i pay my whole way.” They ended up paying for everything but airfare, i think. But i got a terrific trip to Hawaii, and caught up with some people I haven’t seen in ages.
That’s me on airplanes as well - very little sleep, just have to power through the day, maybe take a short nap if I can. Last trip I made to the UK I took a morning flight instead of the redeye. Not only did I sleep better during the trip but the plane was way less crowded, to the point that there were entirely empty rows on the plane.
I view it as the space that is “ours” is calculated while the seats are reclined. If a passenger chooses to travel with their seat not reclined, they are choosing to donate a portion of their space to the passenger behind them which is nice but not necessary.
That said, you won’t find me in coach any more. I only travel in first class, or at the very least… economy plus. Traveling in coach is absolutely miserable and I have the means to spring for a more pleasant travel experience. Starting or ending my vacation or even my work trip being miserable and uncomfortable reduces the pleasure of even going in the first place or the productivity of my work trip. I’d rather go on fewer trips and be happy and comfortable.
This is why I prefer to drive where possible. My husband thinks I’m crazy for considering driving to my in-laws for Thanksgiving but it’s just nicer than flying. And when you calculate the time it takes door-to-door, it adds a lot to the total travel time.
Anything that’s less than an 8 hour drive isn’t even worth discussing: always always always drive. Best-case scenario is that there is a non-stop flight. 30 minutes to drive from the house to the airport. 15 minutes to park the car and get from the parking lot to the terminal. Have to allow an extra 15 minutes in case there’s a problem. Arrive at the terminal 90 minutes prior to flight time for a domestic flight, so we’re at 2.5 hours and we’ve only gotten as far as the local airport. Then a 90 minute flight if the flight is on time is 4 hours to get to your destination airport. Then 30 minutes to get from your seat on the airplane to the door of the airport… 45 minutes if you checked a bag. Then another 30 minutes to get a rental car (skip this part if you take a taxi) and another 45-60 minutes to drive to your final destination. You’re looking at 5:15 minimum in the best-possible-case scenario if you don’t need a rental car at the destination and didn’t check any luggage, and potentially 6:15 before you factor in flight delays. 6 hours and 15 minutes of stress at a time that is convenient to the airline but not necessarily convenient to me, compared to an 8 hour drive that will take place when I choose. I can pack as much or as little as I want and it’s no big deal, make unscheduled stops
The seats in my car are heated and cooled and very comfortable and no one complains when I set them exactly how I like. My car has adaptive cruise control which is really nice, and autosteer which is handy if I need to open a straw from my take-out container, or check the GPS or whatever. Way way less stressful than flying. And if I want to stop and see someone or something interesting along the way, I can do that too.
Flying is for crossing an ocean or at least part of one, or really going cross-country where the time savings is material enough to overcome the hassles.
If you’re going to only be in the downtown of a city where having a car is truly a liability, such as New York or Boston or DC then that definitely does tighten the radius where driving is better than flying. Not having to go through the process of renting a car or deal with finding parking in a crowded downtown does have some advantages. But only if you’re really not planning on doing anything else while you’re out of town. This might be the case if you’re going to a meeting for work and the whole thing is at a single hotel and you have no use for a car other than getting to/from the hotel. But if you’re going to rent a car at your destination anyway… wouldn’t you rather just have your own???
Wow! I find that airplanes and driving break even at about 4 hours. But:
30 minutes to drive to the airport
15 minutes to park, and get to the terminal
60 minutes in advance for a domestic flight (and if I’m a little late, the 60 minutes has some bufffer)
A 4 hour drive is about half an hour of air time, probably scheduled to be 45-60 minutes. And they often chew up most of that time with taxiing and stuff. So call it an hour.
I prefer small aircraft, in part because you deplane faster. I’d call it 15 minutes to get off the plane.
I rarely check a bag for just this reason.
My destination is usually a major city where it’s more convenient to take a cab or the subway, and not have to deal with parking, traffic, and potentially tricky navigation. But it generally takes 15 minutes to get from the plane to the transit, which is… maybe 45 minutes.
So… 30 +15 + 60 + 15 +15 + 45 to get to my destination from the airport comes in at 3 hours, but delays happen.
In practice, the short flight I’ve taken most often is NY to Boston. When I lived in NY I didn’t own a car, so driving involved a lot of additional hassles around renting a car. I often took the train (scheduled for a little more than 4 hours, but usually longer – AMTRAK is always late) because the train was SO much more pleasant. No (or little) security theater, big comfortable seat, a nice view if you face east, and you can get up and walk around when you feel like it. Also, they used to sell food. Not very good food, but it was when you wanted it, not when the flight attendant happened to come by.
I’ve also driven, when I was starting in the other direction. Back when driving was a lot cheaper than flying, and I was poorer, I usually drove. But I found the drive quite stressful, especially as I started to run into NYC traffic on the freeway. Flying is differently stressful, but flying, I just worry about missing the flight, not about getting killed.
Anyway, I think for that distance it’s kind of a tossup, and I have made all the common choices (drive my own car, take a bus, take a train, fly)
But NY - Chicago, NY - Toronto… I wouldn’t even consider driving.
Yeah, train is the way to get from any point on the Acela route to any other point on the Acela route.
And if you don’t even own a car then of course flying will be more attractive. And I acknowledged that if you don’t actually want a car at your destination then that definitely tips the scales in favor of flying. If you’re largely going to be stuck in bad traffic that tips the scales towards flying too. That doesn’t really describe most of my trips though.
I have friends and family in the suburbs of many major cities, so it’s often nice to have the car so that I can drive out to see them… easier than dealing with the train. But when I was in Baltimore for a conference several years ago I did fly and have my friend in Baltimore drive in to the hotel to hang out. But that friend is my age and I didn’t feel bad asking him to drive in town. I’m less comfortable asking septuagenarian relatives to drive into the city at night to see me… I’d rather drive out to them.
It’s largely just that my car is more pleasant to be in than an airplane.
Driven TO-NYC numerous times. Flown multiple times, taken the train once.
Frankly, the travel time isn’t much different. All three will take most of the day.
Flying seems quicker because it’s only an hour up and down (I fly out of Buffalo). But I’ve got an hour or two to the border, then a wait at the airport because you’ve got to be there an hour ahead. Then an hour up and down, then it’s an hour cab ride or so to downtown. And the whole time jammed in with people in sterile environments.
The same carride takes 8-9 hours (so maybe a couple hours slower than flying?) but I like driving and my vehicle is comfy. The slight additional time is worth it for the comfort.
I tooke the train once from Buffalo->NYC and loved it. Almost the same total travel time as flying - because there’s no wait to get on and the train dumps you off right downtown so you save the cab ride from the airport. I booked business class and it was super comfy - lots of leg room.
Yeah, I don’t like driving, certainly not for hours on end. And I get about as stiff in the car as on an airplane. (I get up and walk around on the airplane – can’t do that in the car.) So if it’s quicker to fly, that’s generally my choice.
I agree with twig that if I’m going to want a car at the other end, that tips the scales towards driving. I almost never want a car at the other end, though. It’s just a burden to find a place to park it.
We take an 11 hour (one way) drive - followed by another 3 hour (one way) trip at some point - and then reverse it all, about twice a year. I’ve decided that I like taking the drive overnight - leave at 7pm-ish, get to my parents house about 6am-ish. With overnight there is less traffic to deal with, fewer potty breaks - that sort of thing. I put on headphones with an audio book and usually make it about 6 hours before stopping for gas and letting my wife take over. She goes for 3 or 4 hours, then I go again the rest of the way. If we go during the day I end up driving the whole time, but I can’t do that overnight.
The traveling might be easier by air, but with 5 of us that gets pricey, and then we need to figure out transportation while we are there (especially for the additional 3 hour trip we’ll be making).
I consider reclining on airplanes as the biggest PR coup for airlines ever.
Airlines, in their many efforts to nickel and dime their passengers have squished passengers so closely together that reclining is immensely uncomfortable for the passengers behind.
However, they have managed to turn the narrative around into it being the passengers’ problem, i.e. reclining passengers are rude, inconsiderate etc…
I have noted it to be only a “big” issue on American and European airlines.
On Asian or Middle Eastern airlines which I prefer, everyone simply… well… reclines.
When the person in front reclines all the way back into my face, yes, it is annoying.
All I do is sigh, and recline accordingly myself. As far as I can see, the person behind me then does the same…
Some airlines, such as Malaysian Airlines will ask everyone to straighten their seats during meal service and everyone obliges, no fuss.
Out of curiosity, is it possible that your experience is correlated with the lengths of flights taken.
One of the reasons I don’t recline on planes is because almost all of my flights are domestic daytime flights of 1-3 hours duration. Aside from the rudeness of reclining in limited space, I have no temptation to recline because I’m “up”.
But if I were on a longer flight, where I might need to try to get some real sleep (a redeye, an overnight international flight, a long-duration flight where time zones screw up circadian rhythms), I imagine that I’d prefer to recline if I could reasonably do so / if doing so would help me sleep…and that other passengers would be similarly inclined.
So, I wonder, if your comment about Asian or Middle Eastern airlines might be a reflection of the nature/duration of flights on those airlines, rather than cultural differences.