Death Penalty poll and discussion

You’re right; I probably should’ve said, “many will confuse the two.”

And while the judge might outline items that are “in play” for the trial, the time between such an instruction and when the prosecution asks the “are you comfortable with ____” question might be far enough apart that the “death penalty” may not make it to the forefront of the potential juror’s mind.

And “corporal punishment” brings up an interesting question . . . for those who are opposed to the death penalty (no matter the situation) . . . what are your thoughts around corporal punishment for heinous crimes?

I kinda think that’s worse in a way.

I’m a big fan of not being responsible for others actions, but being responsible for my reaction to their actions. I don’t get to any place where I’m ok having someone killed because of what they’ve done, because it involves me saying killing people is ok. It’s not ok imo.

I am ok with rights being taken away. So I have far less of a problem with prisoners being used for labour. Which I know is something almost of people have a problem with as well.

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Never had a problem with prisoners being used as labor, so long as the working conditions are safe. I always thought of it as the rest of us have to earn a living, Why should committing a crime get them out of that?

That’s also why I don’t mind the prisoners not earning much cash for it. They are already getting housing, food, and medical care. None of that is free.

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Prisons have to stay for profit!

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Sounds good in theory. As long as it doesn’t turn into longer sentences and/or torture to max productivity.

Every option has consequences. Prisoners can still murder. Unless you isolate them completely. Then that becomes cruel. Death is sometimes the best answer.

My guess is that when you factor in the cost of the guards & stuff that prisons are still a net cost to society. Possibly some individuals have some perverse incentives though.

The people who pay for prison and the people who benefit from prison labor aren’t the same, though, so there are perverse incentives.

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Slate has an interview with the spiritual advisor (who was in the execution chamber) to the man who was executed via nitrogen.

The spiritual advisor talked about watching the man die:

Summary

Yeah, it was just absolutely horrific. I knew that it was going to be much more visceral than lethal injection. A lethal injection looks relatively peaceful because of the paralytic. There’s all sorts of interpretations about what actually happens after the paralytic.

With this, it looks like someone, like you said, has a bag over their head, and they’re suffocating to death. But an even better comparison is it looks like someone puts their hands around your neck and chokes you out with their bare hands, because that’s what the resistance looks like. I’ve said that it looked like a fish out of water, just on a dock, suffocating to death. But now I’m beginning to think it’s even more violent than that. It feels like it’s someone putting their hands around someone’s neck and choking them out. That’s how he moved, as if someone was physically killing him with their bare hands.

State officials had said ahead of time the nitrogen gas would make Kenny Smith unconsciouswithin seconds.

Yes, they lied. There’s no other way to describe it. They lied. It was 22 minutes of hell. And it was the most violent thing I’ve ever seen. I was a trauma chaplain at a hospital for a year or so back in Fort Worth—motorcycle crashes, gunshot victims. And this was definitely the most violent thing I’ve ever seen.

I cannot tell whether the struggle of the executed man was limited to him holding his breath, which I cannot think lasted more than several minutes, or continued after, perhaps indicating oxygen was leaking into the mask. I could certainly imagine the initial struggle seeming to an eye witness to take much longer than it actually did because of the emotional impact.

I guess aside from the moral aspect of the death penalty, there’s also the practical aspect of getting people to participate. I suppose maybe certain methods shouldn’t be used if you can’t get anyone to use them.

I think this highlights that whatever method of execution is chosen (drug overdose, hanging, asphyxiation, etc.) the folks who make the product in question primarily for non-execution purposes are not going to want their product to be associated with executions. So the method probably needs to have its own supplier who is specifcally OK with their product being used for executions. This will likely drive up the price a bit. I don’t see a practical way around that. There will always be enough people opposed to the death penalty that mainstream suppliers won’t want to be associated with that and will include that stipulation.

But play your cards right and your product could become the next Cross!

i think that’s an example of a product finding success in a new, larger, unintended market.

I don’t think letting prisoners choose between life sentence or death is death penalty. That sounds more like assted suicide/suicide, which I’m 100% on board with. And that option shouldn’t be afforded to just prisoners, but every citizen.

But yeah, in principle, no one should be able to decide whether another person lives or dies.

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That’s what’s so great about the guillotine. Not a lot of “non-execution purposes” to get in the way.

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